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Regular
Location: Lavallette, NJ 08735 | Trying to take the lazy approach, anyone have a quick comprehensive link for the layman? Also, apologize if I'm intiating threads that have already been addressed; but I can't seem to get any results when utilizing the search prompt for forums. Thanks, Robert |
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Expert
 
Location: Cottage Grove, OR | Do you have the Service Manual? If not, it can be found at this linK: http://www.fmcmotorcoach.com/Manuals.html |
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Veteran
Location: Oslo Norway | The answer to brake bleeding your FMC is understanding the brake system layout ref.the manual.
I struggled a little on #477 I must admit, but I got it right with the help of a good vacuum bleeder and a friend with a lot of patience. I came back to it several times with days in between for a couple of weeks until I got it right.
On my webpage at http://www.fmcmotorcoach.com/Other_info.html there is some more info on brake bleeding also.
Stay cool
Kjetil
#477 |
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Regular
Location: Lavallette, NJ 08735 | Thanks much! I'll let you know how I make out when I get to it. |
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Regular
Location: Lavallette, NJ 08735 | Looked at the links, and while helpful, I'm specifically looking for image(s) of the bleeding points; as opposed to the process. Particularly at the front passenger control booster (if it is there, if not, at the wheel?). Thanks! Robert |
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Expert
Location: Cottage Grove, OR | I believe that the booster for the front brakes is the same as the booster for the rear brakes. Assuming that I am correct, if you locate the bleed nipple on the top of the slave cylinder of the booster for the rear brakes (located in the engine compartment unless moved by a prior owner), the one for the front booster will be in the same location on the booster. You will probably have to feel for it. |
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Veteran
Location: Oslo Norway | Stephen is right.
And there is a bleed valve on each booster as well as at the wheels. Look at the rear booster you will find the bleed valve as marked on the drawing below, then you should have no problem locating it up front.
You may have to bleed at your boosters prior to bleeding at the wheels, several times.
Stay cool
Kjetil
#477 |
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Expert
Location: Cottage Grove, OR | Thanks Kjetil for uploading the diagram. Robert, while you are working on the brakes, you may want to check to see if there is any brake fluid in the boosters themselves. If they start leaking over into the vacumn side of the diaphram, the brake fluid level in the system will be reduced and the brake fluid can work its way up into the intake manifold. |
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Veteran
Location: Canton, (Sixes) GA | Still struggling with brakes on mine after the hose rupture. Cannot get a decent petal so ordered a Mityvac Brake Bleeding Kit
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002RCH9R6/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_... Hopefully it will clear things up.
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Regular
Location: Opelika, Alabama | denshew Let Me know if that works,,,,Heck I just may let You do Mine!!
Your Neighbor in Opelika,Al. 
Edited by ratfink 2012-12-07 5:30 AM
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Veteran
Location: Canton, (Sixes) GA | Will let y'all know how the Mityvac Brake Bleeding Kit works out. I had better brakes before they were upgraded years ago. Kjetil comments about bleeding the hydra vacs (several times) is what I am going to focus on this go around. May not get to it until after the first of the year..ds. |
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Regular
Location: Opelika, Alabama | If You need a hand just Call
Gary |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | My theory on these brakes......
I purchased 0184 a couple months ago for 500 bucks. She's pretty beat, she's pretty ugly, after i got it to run, drove her home without brakes (could'nt get them working?). The brakes sat dry for who knows how long.......after a not needed purchase of a master cylinder, a couple quarts of wasted brake fluid......a "buddy" and my "girlfriend" having sore legs from pumping the brakes for me at different times......and me "up and down and around in the gravel." I now have my Theory.......If your brakes have alot of air in the system....I believe there is not enough volume for fluid in the master cylinder to chase the air out. What happens to me is, i get to bleed the rear hydrovac three maybe four bleeds, then go up front to refill master, air is pushing back into the master cylinder resivoir. I've tried to look past the fact air is moving back into the cylinder and move forward with bleeding the wheel cylinders, but it just doesnt work!!! After talking with Jim Black (really nice and informative person) he sent me the diagrahm for pressure bleeding through the low brake fluid block. I need to go and buy a pressure canister, that you can put atleast two large bottles of brake fluid in, and bleed away with constant steady pressure and adaquate amount of fluid. You can do it by yourself!!! I hope it works. If not i lose |
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Veteran
Location: Canton, (Sixes) GA | Yes, FMC West called for pressure bleeding, FMC East preferred vacuum bleeding. I am going to try the vacuum before long, let me know how the pressure system works.
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Regular
Location: Opelika, Alabama | Being as Mine will need this soon,,,I'l be watching this thread!
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Regular
Location: Opelika, Alabama | Has Anyone tried the bleed system that pushes the bubbles to the master cyl? With the Phoenix MaxPro®, one man can bleed the brakes on any vehicle in 10 minutes or less. I plan to buy and try this system unless Someone here talks Me out of it! |
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Extreme Veteran
Location: Scottsdale, Aridzona | Save a little money - http://www.ebay.com/itm/281043696015?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:VRI&_trk... - cheaper (!) than the Phoenix MaxPro.
Not sure the MaxPro is "patented", have seen reverse bleeder pumps for many years. No US Patent number was listed in any of the links I found for Phoenix MaxPro.
Remember the check valves in the big Hydrovacs, and the check valves at the master cylinder for the smaller hydrovacs. Not sure how that sorts out . . .bleeding "backwards".
Many FMCs have a extended rear hose (and support clip to keep hose out of whirling U-joint) to feed the LOWER cylinder first, and rely on the inside metal tube to carry the fluid and "bubbles" from the lower cylinder to the top cylinder, which makes conventional (master cylinder to HV to wheel cylinder) easier. The front hose feeds the bottom cylinder first as built.
Lou #120 |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | This is Dan with 0184. I finally received my Motive Pressure Brake Bleeder. After modifiying the aluminum adapter plate to fit the master cylinder inside (under the hood) last night, i will b pressure bleeding away this weekend. I will let you all know how it goes..... |
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Expert
Location: Cottage Grove, OR | Dan, I will be very interested in how it goes as I will be doing some brake work later this spring and will need to bleed the brakes. |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | This is Dan with 184.
So i bleed the entire system by myself with the Motive pressure bleeder. The bleeder works great. It can be a little messy at the master cylinder trying to get a good seal. I used a c-clamp style vise grip to hold the bleeder plate down to the master cylinder. I found out with the bleeder that i have a leaky front wheel cylinder now.....and after bleeding the entire system... i have brakes with 4 or 5 pumps (yikes!), and air STILL boils back to the rear brake master cylinder resvoir after i release the pedal (this was my original problem) So........now time to break the system down section by section.....I unhooked the line going out of the rear hydrovac and plugged hydrovac. Bleed some more on the hydrovac, everything stayed the same......so I'm thinking my hydrovac is sucking air or something, so i pull it out and tear it down to the bare casting. I found some moister in the vac canister resting on the bottom (not ideally what you want), all the seals looked and felt great though. The only other bad thing was deposits in the bores (from sitting and moister) So i emery clothed the bores and cleaned everything up and put back together. That was Saturday.
Sunday.....Super Bowl Sunday......I went back at it.
This time rather than hook up the power bleeder.....I convinced my better half to help pump the brakes!! I first plugged off the front brake port at the master cylinder (cause now the fluid drains out overnight due to the leaky brake wheel cylinder). With that port plugged you only have half peddle. I removed the brake line going "into" the rear hydrovac and plugged the line, then with help, bleed just that line. I had a couple decent pockets of air come out. Then with the "out" port of the hydrovac plugged, and the "in" line hooked back up, I bleed the hydrovac. Now i have rear brakes with 1 pump, but thats only to the hydrovac. I think my air/fluid boiling back into the master cylinder is gone too.
Time to go watch the Super Bowl.
Now I have the pressure bleeder attached to just the rear brake line (the out bound line from hydrovac) and im going to pressure bleed just that system, then i will hook it back up to the hydrovac and see what happens.....that is where im at.
I think the pressure bleeder is neat, but not the cure for the break issues I'm having. After you have it set up (which envolves removing the fresh water fill tube mount, by the way, it is rivited from INSIDE of the firewall?? you then can completly flush an entire break system as fast as you can get up and down and around to all the bleed ports!! Its nice to bleed brakes by yourself though, and to be able to bleed separate sections if needed for trouble shooting I suppose.....
Thats all for now.....
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Extreme Veteran
Location: Ignacio Colorado | Denny
I find the mightyvac tends to suck air around the threads of the bleeder. Makes it look like you are getting air from the system but it is just leaking in around the bleed screw.
Just fill the master, have someone pump the pedal about 3 times and hold down, open the bleeder on the front hydrovac and release any pressure. Close bleeder. Now the pedal can be released. Pump it up again and repeat this a couple times, or until no more air bubbles come out. Refill master. Now go to the right front wheel and repeat. Fill master. Now the left front wheel. Refill master. Now to the rear hydrovac. Fill master. Right rear. Fill master. Left rear. fill master and you should be good. Just be sure not to let the master run out during bleeding or you will have to start over.
If this does not make sence have someone that understands this is do the work. Brakes are more importand than having a running engine. They should not be left to just anyone. Some things are not best as a DIY project. I might be in the car in front of you someday.
Bill Sitton. |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | That is why i didnt buy a vacuum bleed style. |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | Brakes are fixed! Found the Raybestos 36359 MC, only found one new one in the US?? In Kentucky!! I snagged it up for 100.00$ The MC i had on it was the over-the-counter standard Mopar oval MC (wrong).....then on to rebuilding all the wheel cylinders....brakes were beautifully covered with old dead spiders, and the wheel cylinders were full of crap. Bench bleed the MC, installed, hooked power bleeder to rear brake service line.....bleed out 7 or 8 oz. on the farthest left rear bleeder valve in the system first to evac some of the large amount of air thats already known to be there. Then the standard bleeding procedure.......Same on front.
The power bleeder kicks a##! I think you could build a bleeder out of any "garden sprayer bottle" if you wanted to. 20 pounds of pressure is plenty for bleeding. Maybe 25 pumps on a 1 gallon jug?? For adapting the bleeder to the system....remove one of your brake lines from the MC..slide the nut back out of the way...adapt a 1/4"x whatever length you want piece of rubber fuel line to your jug, then slide it over the brake line a couple inches and with a couple small hose clamps your in business.
A couple months ago....(before i came to the realization that i was going to have to do a complete tear down of the brakes)....I tried the "clamp down style brake bleeding cover plate" on top of the MC...waste of time, and really messy.
My brakes right now are 3/4 pump, then full pedal (after sitting over night). I could probably gain a little more initial pedal if i bleed with a partner and used the MC, but like driving most "old, vintage, classic, nastalgic, cool" rigs....I'm used to pumping once, then applying the brakes....it's still a habbit for me. |
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Contributor
| After replacing my front wheel cylinders and loosing all fluid. I found the best way and the way I always bleed brakes is to use a pressure bleeder. NAPA has one with multiple master cylinder attachments. Basic garden prayer that hooks to Master.
I made mine. Garden sprayer filled with brake fluid hooked to a plate and gasket up to the master cylinder. Fill the master, hook up the plate, pump up the garden sprayer and start at the bleeder furthest from the master.
Works Great!
phankerson@comcast.net |
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Veteran
Location: Olympia, Washington | We have a Phoenix reverse bleeder, while it works well it is always my last choice reserved for real problem bleeds. If you plan on using it more than once the clean up is a pain. The FMC brake system hydraulics is HUGE! A pressure bleeder is the only way to go, if you only want to use a couple bottles of brake fluid make sure they are gallon bottles. |
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Elite Veteran
Location: Medford, OR | I go out and pump the brakes about every two weeks...I always have 3/4-1/2 brake pedal on first pump. Pressure bleeders kick FMC butt.... |
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Expert
Location: Cottage Grove, OR | Good practice to maintain brakes on a sitting vehicle. |
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Bleeding original brakes